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Trouble the Living


A mother and daughter confront the past in this enthralling debut set in Ireland...
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Did it surprise you to learn that women were so prominently involved in the violence?

Created: 11/02/23

Replies: 23

Posted Nov. 02, 2023 Go to Top | Go to bottom | link | alert
davinamw

Join Date: 10/15/10

Posts: 3442

Did it surprise you to learn that women were so prominently involved in the violence?

The person behind The Real IRA bombing turned out to be a woman, and Brid remarks about the number of times women were the instigators of violence. Did it surprise you to learn that women were so prominently involved?


Posted Nov. 02, 2023 Go to Top | Go to bottom | link | alert
melissa c.

Join Date: 01/10/21

Posts: 122

RE: Did it surprise you to learn that ...

From reading other books and articles, and watching various programs on the Real IRA, I knew that many women were involved in the violence caused by the Real IRA.
It shows us that women are often just as dogmatic about their beliefs as men.


Posted Nov. 02, 2023 Go to Top | Go to bottom | link | alert
laurap

Join Date: 06/19/12

Posts: 408

RE: Did it surprise you to learn that ...

No. I've done other reading about the Troubles - most recently, "Say Nothing" by Patrick Radden , that featured the prominent role of women.


Posted Nov. 02, 2023 Go to Top | Go to bottom | link | alert
rebajane

Join Date: 04/21/11

Posts: 324

RE: Did it surprise you to learn that ...

No, it doesn’t surprise me. Often the women are the ones that instigate violence to protect their husbands as bread winners


Posted Nov. 02, 2023 Go to Top | Go to bottom | link | alert
angelaw

Join Date: 05/26/22

Posts: 90

RE: Did it surprise you to learn that ...

No, women's involvement did not surprise me although it is more recent that women receive a mention.


Posted Nov. 02, 2023 Go to Top | Go to bottom | link | alert
teacher reader

Join Date: 02/14/18

Posts: 64

RE: Did it surprise you to learn that ...

No, I was not surprised. Having read Say Nothing by Patrick Radden Keefe, I felt like I had at least a fair understanding of the whole situation.


Posted Nov. 02, 2023 Go to Top | Go to bottom | link | alert
PTK

Join Date: 01/11/19

Posts: 13

RE: Did it surprise you to learn that ...

Not at all. I’ve done a. Bit of reading about this time and place, but more often than not women are involved in conflicts, revolutions, and wars.


Posted Nov. 03, 2023 Go to Top | Go to bottom | link | alert
ritah

Join Date: 05/26/11

Posts: 80

RE: Did it surprise you to learn that ...

I was not surprised as I believe women have also been involved in causes. You can see that in Dicken’s A Tale of Two Cities and Cassandra’s actions in the Trojan Wars. Women are powerful though often unrecognized.


Posted Nov. 03, 2023 Go to Top | Go to bottom | link | alert
Elizabetta

Join Date: 04/24/21

Posts: 54

RE: Did it surprise you to learn that ...

No, I was not surprised to see a woman at the center of this novel. I too have read Say Nothing as well as TransAtlantic (Collum McCann)and the role women played cannot be overstated. While not front and center women have been involved in the fight for justice through out history and there are countless novels that depict their struggle. Trouble the Living gives insight into the price women pay for such involvement.


Posted Nov. 04, 2023 Go to Top | Go to bottom | link | alert
janeh

Join Date: 06/15/11

Posts: 222

RE: Did it surprise you to learn that ...

Not at all ... especially the subservient roles they were given. They LET her become part of their group by giving her a menial task; one that if she were stopped with the materials would end up with her going to jail. This left the men free to call the shots and direct the action. Women are usually the strong, silent backbones of most conflicts. I think if women were in the driver's seat in world negotiations, we would have fewer conflicts. Women have had to negotiate in every aspect of their lives to get through .... with employers, parents, husbands and children. As such, most aren't held prisoner by their egos. It seems most wars are caused by men's egos drawing lines and refusing to compromise. Will be interesting to see as more women get in more positions of real influence if it will change the tenor of how conflict is handled.


Posted Nov. 04, 2023 Go to Top | Go to bottom | link | alert
beckyd

Join Date: 07/31/19

Posts: 105

RE: Did it surprise you to learn that ...

Well, I hadn't really thought about it before. Unlike all of the other responders above I haven't read any other book about the troubles.


Posted Nov. 05, 2023 Go to Top | Go to bottom | link | alert
triciat50

Join Date: 02/26/22

Posts: 54

RE: Did it surprise you to learn that ...

Not at all. Women have been involved in war and insurrections for centuries, but in twentieth-century Ireland, they became much more prominent. I think this is something we're going to see more and more. Look how many women are serving in the armed forces in our modern times?


Posted Nov. 08, 2023 Go to Top | Go to bottom | link | alert
elleng55

Join Date: 09/21/23

Posts: 4

RE: Did it surprise you to learn that ...

Women always seem to be involved in revolutions and wars. Brid felt very strongly about the cause and wanted to do her part,wanted to win her mother's love by doing so.


Posted Nov. 10, 2023 Go to Top | Go to bottom | link | alert
jills

Join Date: 10/19/11

Posts: 9

RE: Did it surprise you to learn that ...

Not in the least. I have read a lot of Irish literature and many books are brutally honest about the violence created by Northern Ireland's bigotry and violence. I'm thinking of Trespasses by Louise Kennedy, for example. Brid's motivation in Trouble the Living is convincingly laid out.


Posted Nov. 11, 2023 Go to Top | Go to bottom | link | alert
wendyf

Join Date: 05/11/11

Posts: 80

RE: Did it surprise you to learn that ...

Not at all surprised by this. Women have been involved in fighting for their beliefs in so many ways. I think it might affect women in a different way however. But women are capable of difficult and sometimes evil deeds.


Posted Nov. 11, 2023 Go to Top | Go to bottom | link | alert
paulagb

Join Date: 08/16/17

Posts: 175

RE: Did it surprise you to learn that ...

Women are often more dogmatic in their beliefs than men. Frequently they are in the shadows so they may not receive the blame they deserve. The hand that rocks the cradle has a major role in pushing their children toward fanatacism, even terrorism.


Posted Nov. 14, 2023 Go to Top | Go to bottom | link | alert
skagitgrits's Gravatar
skagitgrits

Join Date: 02/24/17

Posts: 64

RE: Did it surprise you to learn that ...

No surprise. The Celts, and the Irish in particular, have a long history of a strong, matriarchal cultural tradition in spite of societal, and legal constraints placed upon them. There are many examples of women taking non-traditional roles in Irish history. Consider the following as examples,
Boudica, the Iceni Queen of War, Maeve, ruler and warrior queen of Connaught, Grace O'Malley, the Irish Pirate Queen,
Constance Markievicz, poet and political activist and first-ever female MP elected to the House of Commons in 1918, just two years after she took up arms against the British in the 1916 Rising in Dublin.
Sinead O'Conner, musician and political activist
As of 2023, 33 women have served as Ministers of State in Ireland.

There are, of course, other Irish women who have contributed through literature, poetry, musical and dance arts, education and a myriad of other areas.


Posted Nov. 14, 2023 Go to Top | Go to bottom | link | alert
kdowney25

Join Date: 01/25/16

Posts: 189

RE: Did it surprise you to learn that ...

No, it didn’t really surprise me that women were so involved in violence. I think the reason women would be so active in such acts though are not necessarily because they believe so strongly in the cause. Perhaps some get involved in groups like this because of their personal relationships.


Posted Nov. 14, 2023 Go to Top | Go to bottom | link | alert
kimk

Join Date: 10/16/10

Posts: 987

RE: Did it surprise you to learn that ...

I guess I'm in the minority in that I *was* surprised. I tend to think of war as men's work, even though that's less and less true. And I have to admit Madame Defarge from Tale of Two Cities did cross my mind as I thought about this question, so I guess it really *shouldn't* surprise me.


Posted Nov. 18, 2023 Go to Top | Go to bottom | link | alert
ColoradoGirl

Join Date: 05/16/16

Posts: 161

RE: Did it surprise you to learn that ...

I think I equate soliders mostly with men although that is changing. Women are definitely involved and are viewed with less suspicion. Like Kimk, yes, war is often viewed as men's work. In the US, women have never been drafted and had to fight to get combat positions.


Posted Nov. 20, 2023 Go to Top | Go to bottom | link | alert
marganna

Join Date: 10/14/11

Posts: 153

RE: Did it surprise you to learn that ...

There was so little about the "Troubles" that it could have been any conflict/war. Yes, women were mentioned but not developed in relation to the conflict that Ireland suffered for such an extended time. I, too, just read "Say Nothing" by Patrick Radden which is an awesome book. In Belfast this April my Black Taxi driver, a former IRA member, suggested we read it. It's powerful!


Posted Nov. 21, 2023 Go to Top | Go to bottom | link | alert
johnw

Join Date: 03/11/12

Posts: 102

RE: Did it surprise you to learn that ...

No - like most things in history and life women's involvement or as leaders were not given credit or acknowledged.


Posted Nov. 28, 2023 Go to Top | Go to bottom | link | alert
beckys

Join Date: 08/12/16

Posts: 259

RE: Did it surprise you to learn that ...

I didn't know this was the case until reading this book, but it doesn't surprise me. I know lots of women that are very politically charged and I think maybe the women were able to go "under the wire" with some of the covert operations because sometimes men underestimate them.


Posted Dec. 08, 2023 Go to Top | Go to bottom | link | alert
juliaa

Join Date: 12/03/11

Posts: 276

RE: Did it surprise you to learn that ...

It did not surprise me at all, from my other reading and remembering news accounts during "the troubles."


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